tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post2052137725305911673..comments2023-09-27T07:44:19.769-04:00Comments on Sabine Hossenfelder: Backreaction: Do we need a Theory of Everything?Sabine Hossenfelderhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06151209308084588985noreply@blogger.comBlogger261125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-86268435471641052762021-05-07T16:21:36.664-04:002021-05-07T16:21:36.664-04:00@Prof. David Edwards
"By Godel's Theorem...@Prof. David Edwards<br /><br />"By Godel's Theorem the currently axioms for arithmetic can only be empirically assumed to be consistent but cannot be proven to be so from more reliable axioms."<br /><br />Gödel's Second Incompleteness Theorem tells that consistency of Arithmetic System is unprovable within this System, UNLESS this System is inconsistent. <br />I would like to Łukaszhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04986441374680433282noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-6039289731667815032020-09-28T06:56:04.910-04:002020-09-28T06:56:04.910-04:00Here is the link https://vimeo.com/8561647Here is the link https://vimeo.com/8561647Catalinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06192244112905762189noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-18412925925576485842020-09-28T06:55:22.743-04:002020-09-28T06:55:22.743-04:00Just came across this condensed version of Jürgen ...Just came across this condensed version of Jürgen Schmidhuber’s talk on art, beauty and it's relationship to data compression and learning. Maybe beauty in physics works the same way.Catalinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06192244112905762189noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-86207883569962831312020-08-11T11:59:25.991-04:002020-08-11T11:59:25.991-04:00Hello Adramelekh,
You're right. You're ab...Hello Adramelekh,<br /><br />You're right. You're absolutely right. We're not designed to understand the universe.<br />That's why scientific progress is so difficult to achieve.<br /><br />With your <br />"The idea that smaller particles "make up" larger particles <br />is a strong paradigm that has its roots in our evolutionary history." <br />you pretty Stefan Freundthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04834262116439292657noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-30722437748853538182020-08-06T21:39:18.295-04:002020-08-06T21:39:18.295-04:00Steven Evans,
You seem to be saying that the chem...Steven Evans,<br /><br />You seem to be saying that the chemistry and biology of cells and other living things involves entirely new powers unknown to physics. I.e. you seem to be saying that what is happening in cells and other living things cannot be reduced to (what we would represent as) lawful and logical relationships, variables, numbers and quantum mechanical interactions.<br /><br />But ILorraine Fordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00175567853773691970noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-60731865271495154642020-08-06T21:35:14.970-04:002020-08-06T21:35:14.970-04:00Dr Castaldo,
There is nothing out there in the un...Dr Castaldo,<br /><br />There is nothing out there in the universe keeping tabs on the patterns or “arrangements of matter” that you refer to. You are talking about a category of information that doesn’t exist; and non-existent information has no effect on the world. There is no such known-to-physics category of information as “pattern” or “arrangement of matter”: there is only (e.g.) relative Lorraine Fordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00175567853773691970noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-17489908905127980552020-08-05T22:44:40.355-04:002020-08-05T22:44:40.355-04:00Lorraine Ford10:35 AM, August 05, 2020
"ther...Lorraine Ford10:35 AM, August 05, 2020<br /><br />"there’s no need to have a fit."<br />I beg to differ.<br /><br />" However, every outcome of lawful relationships between variables, and interactions between matter, will also be variables and numbers that apply to matter. "<br /><br />A cell in a human body is made of matter. It's not immediately obvious from its complex Steven Evanshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13898046706669437332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-16557028801018651732020-08-05T15:49:02.155-04:002020-08-05T15:49:02.155-04:00Lorraine: An emergent conscious experience would a...Lorraine: An emergent conscious experience would arise from an <b>arrangement</b> of matter, as does life itself, or the function of any machine.<br /><br />You can indeed apply numbers to a bar and fulcrum that represents the emergent properties of a lever, we do that all the time. But those "lever" numbers are largely independent of the numbers associated with the atoms making up the Dr. A.M. Castaldohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17988116835722393503noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-49435846069660423002020-08-05T13:50:05.250-04:002020-08-05T13:50:05.250-04:00My final contribution to the discussion on conscio...My final contribution to the discussion on consciousness would be to suggest that its better to not write anything on line that you would not say to someone standing close enough to punch you in the nose.Steve Bullfoxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13990244011256349875noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-39688037939593362862020-08-05T10:35:39.072-04:002020-08-05T10:35:39.072-04:00Steven Evans, there’s no need to have a fit.
You ...Steven Evans, there’s no need to have a fit.<br /><br />You say: “I'm not claiming anything”. However, every outcome of lawful relationships between variables, and interactions between matter, will also be variables and numbers that apply to matter. So if you say that subjective conscious experience “emerges”, then you are either talking about miracles, or you are talking about a subjective Lorraine Fordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00175567853773691970noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-34765870939802935552020-08-05T05:57:07.283-04:002020-08-05T05:57:07.283-04:00PhysicistDave2:52 AM, August 05, 2020
"Show ...PhysicistDave2:52 AM, August 05, 2020<br /><br />"Show me the formal derivation" <br />It is not me who is claiming to have a formal derivation. It is you. And you *still* have failed to provide one. You are simply a liar.<br /><br />"I have given a valid mathematical proof showing why you can't."<br />Boll*cks, you have. You are an inveterate liar. Where have you written Steven Evanshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13898046706669437332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-81900881011047160792020-08-05T03:27:10.838-04:002020-08-05T03:27:10.838-04:00Lorraine Ford8:30 PM, August 04, 2020
"So: 1...Lorraine Ford8:30 PM, August 04, 2020<br /><br />"So: 1) Will you represent subjective conscious experience as a single variable, or a set of variables; and 2) How do you measure these variables? "<br /><br />What on Earth are you wittering on about, you moron? There is no representation of conscious experience in terms of matter. <br /><br />But you claim that there **cannot** be any Steven Evanshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13898046706669437332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-3342061754679340052020-08-05T02:55:51.306-04:002020-08-05T02:55:51.306-04:00PhysicistDave12:53 AM, August 04, 2020
"A te...PhysicistDave12:53 AM, August 04, 2020<br /><br />"A term not mentioned in the axioms or the premises cannot occur in the conclusion, except in a trivial, tautological manner. "<br /><br />What are you talking about, you complete halfwit? So a "cell" in biology is not a physical object because the term "cell" is not mentioned in the laws of Physics?<br /><br />I Steven Evanshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13898046706669437332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-62242648909002314392020-08-05T02:52:09.117-04:002020-08-05T02:52:09.117-04:00Steven Evans wrote to me:
>Don't mention th...Steven Evans wrote to me:<br />>Don't mention that Caesar Dave is just assuming conscious experience cannot be derived from physics, and so is simply assuming the answer.<br /><br />Show me the formal derivation that starts with premises that do not mention subjective experience and draws a valid conclusion that does refer (non-tautologically) to subjective experience. You cannot do so PhysicistDavehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11111405959451703182noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-36780370338894087492020-08-05T02:48:52.355-04:002020-08-05T02:48:52.355-04:00PhysicistDave12:53 AM, August 04, 2020
"What...PhysicistDave12:53 AM, August 04, 2020<br /><br />"What I have proven is that the currently known laws of physics cannot explain consciousness."<br /><br />No you haven't. You are a liar.<br />You have simply assumed that what we are subjectively aware of as the mind cannot be derived from physics. But that's the question. The question is whether the mind can be derived from or Steven Evanshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13898046706669437332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-23690138060697421552020-08-05T02:45:58.560-04:002020-08-05T02:45:58.560-04:00Marty Tysanner7:41 AM, August 03, 2020
" We ...Marty Tysanner7:41 AM, August 03, 2020<br /><br />" We have no definite evidence for either position, so where does the confidence come from to make your strong claim?"<br /><br />It's not my claim, it is Dr. H's. And it's not strong. As soon as one says "as far as we know", one is of course covering oneself. So what's the point of saying it? Well, it's Steven Evanshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13898046706669437332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-11220133284609570472020-08-04T22:03:03.079-04:002020-08-04T22:03:03.079-04:00PhysicistDave5:23 PM, August 02, 2020
“Veni, vidi...PhysicistDave5:23 PM, August 02, 2020<br /><br />“Veni, vidi, vici.”<br /><br />And here it is, Caesar Dave's "logical proof" that it is impossible for the mind to be weakly emergent from a physical brain:<br /><br />"If a term, eg 'slithy' does not occur in the axioms or the rules of inference or the premises of an argument, that term cannot occur in the conclusion of Steven Evanshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13898046706669437332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-67018193705733414242020-08-04T20:30:27.024-04:002020-08-04T20:30:27.024-04:00There’s the flat-earthers, the “sovereign citizens...There’s the flat-earthers, the “sovereign citizens” who won’t wear face-masks, and then there’s Steven Evans and the other worshippers of the “consciousness equation”: the supposedly-existing lawful relationship(s)/ algorithm(s) that can transform billiard balls into subjectively experiencing entities.<br /><br />First off, the consciousness-equationers need to decide whether the consciousness Lorraine Fordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00175567853773691970noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-22893393674394656362020-08-04T12:16:36.730-04:002020-08-04T12:16:36.730-04:00Hello Sabine, I have a question that I think is re...Hello Sabine, I have a question that I think is related to the idea of a theory of everything. The idea that smaller particles "make up" larger particles is a strong paradigm that has its roots in our evolutionary history. Do you think abolishing this paradigm would be possible? Can there be a completely symmetrical causality independent of scale or a unified causality independent of Adramelekhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08365214659364373278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-41021069381110801502020-08-04T00:53:42.194-04:002020-08-04T00:53:42.194-04:00Steven Evans wrote to me:
>On this point you cl...Steven Evans wrote to me:<br />>On this point you claimed that you can provide a logical proof that refutes the possibility of conscious experience being weakly emergent from a physical brain. No sane person believes your ludicrous claim, <br /><br />Well, I actually dislike using the terms “emergent” and 'emergence” simply because they mean different things to different people.<br /><br /PhysicistDavehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11111405959451703182noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-59425725527315876542020-08-03T21:47:14.369-04:002020-08-03T21:47:14.369-04:00In response to:
"we are talking about the is...In response to:<br /><br />"we are talking about the issue of how those interior feelings are possible in a universe that is, certainly, largely physical.<br /><br />You do not have to participate in that discussion. But, if that is your intent, it would be nice for you to own up to it."--Dr. Miller<br /><br />I have explained my position on that issue at this site several times, as JimVhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10198704789965278981noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-36817852674406676072020-08-03T20:00:49.722-04:002020-08-03T20:00:49.722-04:00Lorraine Ford10:35 AM, August 03, 2020
"What...Lorraine Ford10:35 AM, August 03, 2020<br /><br />"What you say is nonsense:"<br /><br />OK. Now you just need to provide a reason to support yet another unjustified claim. Otherwise you are just a liar like Dave.<br /><br />Maybe we should maintain a list of liars in these comments:<br /><br />Philip Goff<br />Phillip Helbig<br />Luke Barnes<br />Dave Miller<br />Lorraine Ford<br /><brSteven Evanshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13898046706669437332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-12690913550836817042020-08-03T10:35:35.503-04:002020-08-03T10:35:35.503-04:00Steven Evans,
What you say is nonsense:
“Consci...Steven Evans,<br /><br />What you say is nonsense: <br /><br />“Conscious experience has not been observed, at least not in full detail; but that doesn't mean it cannot be observed … it cannot be ruled out that conscious experience will be objectively observed. In fact, all empirical evidence suggests so…” Lorraine Fordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00175567853773691970noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-7241621475016351372020-08-03T07:57:05.944-04:002020-08-03T07:57:05.944-04:00Dr. A.M. Castaldo7:28 AM, August 03, 2020
I would...Dr. A.M. Castaldo7:28 AM, August 03, 2020<br /><br />I wouldn't engage any more Dr. C. As well as being competent in the technical details of quantum theory, Dave is also a lying troll.<br /><br />He has claimed 30 times to have a logical proof (not an argument, but an actual logical proof) that the mind cannot be weakly emergent from the brain, but has failed to provide such a proof. Steven Evanshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13898046706669437332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-25327293290910433352020-08-03T07:46:15.982-04:002020-08-03T07:46:15.982-04:00[cont'd]
The idea is to posit a new interacti...[cont'd]<br /><br />The idea is to posit a new interaction in <i>d</i>+1 dimensions from a carefully chosen higher symmetry group, analogously to the above procedure, such that the new interaction has some 'overlap' with electromagnetism in 3+1 dimensions. Presumably <i>d</i> > 1; otherwise the new interaction would almost certainly have been detected experimentally by now. The Marty Tysannerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18113481752481566995noreply@blogger.com