tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post1592158765358118333..comments2023-09-27T07:44:19.769-04:00Comments on Sabine Hossenfelder: Backreaction: Excuse me, where is the mainstream?Sabine Hossenfelderhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06151209308084588985noreply@blogger.comBlogger28125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-39267673539785694342013-04-19T16:03:54.015-04:002013-04-19T16:03:54.015-04:00Hmmm.....let me try something different here.
Nan...Hmmm.....let me try something different here.<br /><br /><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nanoparticle#Background" rel="nofollow">Nano particulates</a> for instance.<br /><br /> <a href="http://www.innventia.com/en/Our-Expertise/New-materials/Nanocellulose/" rel="nofollow">New area research being developed</a> for applicability, but not really that new. In recognition of powers of ten it PlatoHagelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00849253658526056393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-66526069733604285642013-04-19T15:10:27.901-04:002013-04-19T15:10:27.901-04:00Frank, that's a noble goal of yours (I turned ...Frank, that's a noble goal of yours (I turned 40 and I wish I could have your ambitions or energy) but don't you think your assertions are a bit grandiose?<br /><br />You must be modest for people to take you seriously otherwise you might fall into the crackpot/pseudoscience category, especially by acknowledging that you theory is not mathematical backed up.Giotishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03594944884584261018noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-4082962329139829822013-04-19T03:26:35.049-04:002013-04-19T03:26:35.049-04:00Hi Snowboarder,
Yes, that's right that mainst...Hi Snowboarder,<br /><br />Yes, that's right that mainstream research "does not presuppose a significant conflict with currently accepted principles/theories/data", but I would argue that this is pretty much a consequence of it not being "too surprising."<br /><br />About the small steps, I agree. "Not too far into the speculative" is what I meant, but you are Sabine Hossenfelderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06151209308084588985noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-49206106740612994882013-04-19T03:20:18.338-04:002013-04-19T03:20:18.338-04:00Hi Phil,
It's a nice analogy, and I don't...Hi Phil,<br /><br />It's a nice analogy, and I don't mind it indicating a process that repeats, for that is the case also in science. Every answer brings a new question and so it all starts over again. Best,<br /><br />B.Sabine Hossenfelderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06151209308084588985noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-19606829127253346862013-04-19T03:18:02.840-04:002013-04-19T03:18:02.840-04:00Hi Frank,
Thanks for the kind offer. Unfortunatel...Hi Frank,<br /><br />Thanks for the kind offer. Unfortunately, I presently just don't have spare time and I have too many projects on my hand already. I wish you good luck anyway, and don't be afraid of maths, no matter what your age, you can learn it. Best,<br /><br />B.Sabine Hossenfelderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06151209308084588985noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-20782366587230337322013-04-19T01:24:37.193-04:002013-04-19T01:24:37.193-04:00I think you'll have to accept that the "m...I think you'll have to accept that the "mainstream" you're looking for is not a criterion of the research itself but of the sociology of research.<br /><br />I think he main stream is first defined by famous/successful scientists and what they find interesting, and then flows outward by association - either topical ("... tests an aspect of famous person's conjecture&Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-43640387705441548062013-04-18T18:59:07.407-04:002013-04-18T18:59:07.407-04:00/* Anybody remembers unparticles? The pentaquark? .../* Anybody remembers unparticles? The pentaquark? The so-called OPERA anomaly? These fads aren’t as extreme in other areas of physics (or so I am told) but they exist, if less pronounced... */<br /><br />The mainstream and alternative science may overlap in time, but not in space. Many occasional findings or insights of mainstream physics become alternative physics for long time and vice-versa. Zephirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06010623752049244967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-8807758559218649082013-04-18T18:50:30.563-04:002013-04-18T18:50:30.563-04:00The typical aspect of mainstream science is just t...The typical aspect of mainstream science is just the plain ignorance of opposition. For me it's symptomatic if not funny, when some mainstream physicist claims, that the mainstream science doesn't exist and that only "pseudoscientists" are saying it. Well - just these "pseudoscientists" are who belong into alternative science, which the mainstream scientists refuse to Zephirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06010623752049244967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-58122202178749247462013-04-18T18:25:14.870-04:002013-04-18T18:25:14.870-04:00Of course, many mainstream physicists (including t...Of course, many mainstream physicists (including the Bee) are starting to realize, they're an ignorants - so they tend to pretend, that the findings which were researched for many years outside of mainstream belong to mainstream from their very beginning at the moment, when their effectiveness becomes proven finally. This is IMO the way, in which the hypocritical stance presented in this Zephirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06010623752049244967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-70497605402267641072013-04-18T18:17:57.594-04:002013-04-18T18:17:57.594-04:00It's quite easy to distinguish what the mainst...It's quite easy to distinguish what the mainstream science is and what isn't by peer-reviewed replication criterion. The findings, which are never attempted to replicate in peer-reviewed journals belong into alternative science. In this way, the mainstream physics doesn't recognize an aether, scalar waves, cold fusion, magnetic motors, antigravity, psychic phenomena, memory of water Zephirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06010623752049244967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-77672625377484778512013-04-18T17:19:43.695-04:002013-04-18T17:19:43.695-04:00......not just a tracker of people and their respe.........not just a tracker of people and their respective sciences but of the latest information as well.<br /><br />So you at your black board showing the map with which took you to your point.....where does this then lead you? <br /><br />If you are keeping track of the experiments and how hey are connected then this leads one's thought hopefully to the question of trying to ascertain the PlatoHagelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00849253658526056393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-46195742501386423802013-04-18T17:02:58.989-04:002013-04-18T17:02:58.989-04:00BeeKnowledge discovery is like the mapping of unkn...<b>Bee</b><i>Knowledge discovery is like the mapping of unknown territory. At any time, we have a map with a boundary beyond which we do not know what to expect. Applied research is building on the territory that we have mapped. Basic research is planning expeditions into the unknown to extend the map and with it the area that we can build on.</i> <br /><br />I like the way this is written. PlatoHagelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00849253658526056393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-25494907013281494012013-04-18T16:58:48.397-04:002013-04-18T16:58:48.397-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.PlatoHagelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00849253658526056393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-49227711710266502172013-04-18T15:20:09.903-04:002013-04-18T15:20:09.903-04:00Thanks Phillip Helbig, for the reality check, your...Thanks Phillip Helbig, for the reality check, your valuable comment regarding the critical importance of unique, testable predictions. <br /><br />Our focus, to this point, has been on the development of the fundamental physics that connect such diverse evolutionary phenomena as cosmic exponential inflation, the emergence of the fundamental particles and interactions of the standard model, the Frank Burdgehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07145758070504933144noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-71835203932378282222013-04-18T14:01:19.761-04:002013-04-18T14:01:19.761-04:00Thanks Bee, for your reply and your encouragement....Thanks Bee, for your reply and your encouragement. The greatest deficiency of our model is the absence of higher maths. Nether my partner, nor I, have the training or the ability to develop the field equations that are essential to any complete cosmological model. At ages 70 and 88 years, our math tools have substantially rusted. We perceive our model to be consistent with the state of the Frank Burdgehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07145758070504933144noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-79612903150125038542013-04-18T10:14:57.416-04:002013-04-18T10:14:57.416-04:00First, I would define "mainstream physics&quo...First, I would define "mainstream physics" as an area of physics where it is clear what the important problems are and also how progress is to be made. For example, back in the 1950s when several new elementary particles were discovered, it was mainstream physics to classify them. Something which is not mainstream is then an area where it is not clear what the important problems are Phillip Helbighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12067585245603436809noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-78258669520824496442013-04-18T07:51:06.355-04:002013-04-18T07:51:06.355-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Christine Cordula Dantashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05271747374185459530noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-65194182904065686392013-04-18T07:24:24.305-04:002013-04-18T07:24:24.305-04:00Hi Bee,
I like and agree with your definition of ...Hi Bee,<br /><br />I like and agree with your definition of what mainstream research should boil down to be and yet never liked the term itself, as resultant of the mental image it imparts; well at least in me. That is a mainstream could be said to be equated with a river, whose waters are dependent upon the smaller streams ond tributaries which supply it with the water it contains. This part Phil Warnellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15671311338712852659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-15796241202359242752013-04-18T01:27:31.349-04:002013-04-18T01:27:31.349-04:00Hi Frank,
Let me put it like this: You cannot com...Hi Frank,<br /><br />Let me put it like this: You cannot come up with an explanation for quantum gravity, dark energy and dark matter without understanding in depth what these problems entail to begin with. I don't know what exactly you mean when you write that your attempts are not "at a level acceptable by mainstream physicists", but I suspect it means they're not up to the Sabine Hossenfelderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06151209308084588985noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-19343698883141106772013-04-18T01:16:55.182-04:002013-04-18T01:16:55.182-04:00Hi Uair,
Exactly... :) thanks for making the conn...Hi Uair,<br /><br />Exactly... :) thanks for making the connection! Best,<br /><br />B.Sabine Hossenfelderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06151209308084588985noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-29826877914338320882013-04-18T01:15:38.852-04:002013-04-18T01:15:38.852-04:00Hi Giotis,
Ah, good point, there are local differ...Hi Giotis,<br /><br />Ah, good point, there are local differences of course. Best,<br /><br />B.Sabine Hossenfelderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06151209308084588985noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-33290526471125484322013-04-17T19:53:44.441-04:002013-04-17T19:53:44.441-04:00Bee - I think your definition is in part correct b...Bee - I think your definition is in part correct but I would include something along the lines of "research which does not presuppose a significant conflict with currently accepted principles/theories/data." <br /><br />I don't think that prima facie means only small steps, just that the step not require a leap into the very speculative or areas which would have little or no soundAnonymous Snowboarderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13705929076819672791noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-11208840075382685032013-04-17T19:25:40.875-04:002013-04-17T19:25:40.875-04:00Mainstream is flashy mediocrity holding a vast aud...Mainstream is flashy mediocrity holding a vast audience diligently converting glitter into a tyranny of immersive falsehoods, an abusive hegemony of beige, pluralistic ignorance, compulsory degradative egalitarianism. Mainstream is a peer vote by administration not peers. Mainstream is drinking downstream from the herd.<br /><br />Mainstream is showing a little thigh as an exercise of Uncle Alhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05056804084187606211noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-26655609872056678422013-04-17T18:38:36.363-04:002013-04-17T18:38:36.363-04:00Sabine, I agree with your conclusion and I found y...Sabine, I agree with your conclusion and I found your analysis interesting and thought provoking, but also, in a rather tangential aspect, somewhat unsettling. As I read your discussion, I found myself relating your ideas to the context of my own efforts in amateur theoretical physics. The question I am reluctant, but compelled, to ask is whether those of you who are legitimately in the Frank Burdgehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07145758070504933144noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22973357.post-86025375659822732542013-04-17T17:09:23.285-04:002013-04-17T17:09:23.285-04:00The definition of "mainstream" you end u...The definition of "mainstream" you end up with is not too different from Thomas Kuhn's definition of "normal science" in his <i>The Structure of Scientific Revolutions</i> (1962). Kuhn describes this mode of scientific work as "puzzle solving," seeking to tie up loose ends of the currently reigning "paradigm" rather than overthrow it. Kuhn also argues Alex W.https://www.blogger.com/profile/02208103937410937273noreply@blogger.com